Exclusive (For now): Blogger's Interview with Nick Clegg Part 2 - Obama and Populism

This blog is closed and has moved to http://Charlottegore.com. See you there!

This is it. My question to Nick. Is Obama's success, whether he wins or not, a vindication of Social Democracy or Populism? Is there any future for anything other than populism in mainstream Western Democracies?


Nick isn't amused. "If you're saying that Obama's been a populist, I think that's unfair. I do."


I regret my question instantly. Nick, who had been mirroring Joe's body language, suddenly begins shuffling. "Populism runs like a thread through politics, of course... how do you define populism?"


More changing of posture, but he continues:


"The worst form of populism is appealing to prejudice or popular hysteria or need in a way that you can't deliver, or is wholy unnecessary, or is outright bad for the country you want to represent."


I want to push further. I want to say if it's not populism then, what is it? Are Americans shifting left?


"I think he's inevitably been a lot more cautious on issues than I would like him to be, he's slightly overrelied on lofty rhetoric and a general sentiment of change rather than produce concrete, grounded policy in the way that people like us who care about concrete grounded policy might think, but I don't regard him as a populist. I think he has enormous, self evident skills as a politician but probably the greatest recruiting sergeant for Obama in addition to his own skills is of course George Bush."


There's a collective nod in the room.


"This is why I always thought Obama would beat Hilary Clinton. Because when you have a country in despair about its current government, if you have two people seeking to replace that current government and one is saying 'I'll be different and I'll be change' and the other is saying 'I've got experience' it seems to me a no-brainer, the change candidate is going to win."


I wonder if I've extracted Clegg's prediction for the Presidential election... and maybe our next General Election.


"You've seen it now in the way that Obama does his rallys. It used to be 'change you can believe in' and now they've brought it down to just 'change'. Just one word that's on his placards when you look on the evening news. 'Cometh the hour, cometh the man'. America is crying out for change and he's providing that vehicle for change, and that's probably the most important thing of all."


Yes, I think I have. I wonder how much Obama is indirectly influencing the messages coming from our party? Clegg is paying attention, that much is certain - and seems to have a clear and unambiguous preference. But with all this talk of 'change' and how this might be Obama's ticket to victory, I ask the obvious question: Does policy even matter?


"Yes of course it matters!"


Well that sorts that out then. Will the change be real though?


"My crystal ball is no clearer than yours. It's obvious to say that expectations have been raised about him that are going to be incredibly difficult to maintain. He now appears to be mobilising a coalition of political forces that are united only on the desire to have something different, and not at all united on what they see coming next."


Which, really, is my point here. Obama's success comes from his ability to inspire and motivate, to encourage people to dare to hope, to pin their desire for change on him. But Clegg has now hit his stride, and seems comfortable talking about Obama as if he'd already won.


"I hope he has the courage of his convictions and not feel overstretched and immobilised by the coalition that put him into the Whitehouse."


Eeek. Fingers crossed, eh?


"That's always the danger of a first term president - they play it safe in order to get a second term, and then of course they've only got a few months before they're a lame duck. That's the pattern of american politics... I don't know the man. I see what you see. I hope his background, his writings, and all the rest of it, will mean he's released from the inevitable compromises of the campaign to spread his wings next. What can I do other than hope?"


But Nick is still uncomfortable with the premise of the question. Obama Doubt is not a fashionable opinion, but having experienced first hand falling for Tony Blair's slick skills I consider myself once bitten, but then perhaps I'm just as frightened by the prospect that Obama is the real deal, and may actually take America in a more European direction. I'm not sure I want that. There's got to be somewhere on this Earth that's different. Maybe better. I used to think that about America. I hope I can do again, one day.


"Why do you think Obama is a populist?" Nick asks me, and at this point Jonathan Calder, of Liberal England helpfully steps in and brings up the other 'p' word: Protectionism.


"Actually that's a good point. The protectionist stuff was not good at all."


Phew.


"Well Actually," says Jonathan. "That brings me to my question."


And I can relax for a bit, although I wonder if I succeeded in my mission to find out something new about Nick. I get the feeling that it was the talk of populism that touched the nerve, not invoking Obama's name. Is there a conflict at the heart of our party?


To be continued in Part 3.

This blog is closed and has moved to http://Charlottegore.com. See you there!